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Machiavelli.

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Machiavelli.

Post  Piratus on Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:15 am

I have a history assignment I need to do, and I think this is the perfect place to ask questions. (if you guys don't mind).
I choose to make a little essay about Niccoló Machiavelli, a pretty fascinating person, and since I still think there are a few history geeks out here, why not hold a discussion here? Wink
I would apretiate any information you have, but I can easily dig it up myself, thanks to the internetz. what I'm more instrested to know is if he wrote his most famous book "The prince"(?) as a sort of satire, to insult his enemy (what's his name?) or if he was beeing serious.
P.S I am pretty sure Pishk incorporated parts of Machiavelli's book "The prince" in a mission somewhere. I feel I should dig it up, just for fun!
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Piratus

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Re: Machiavelli.

Post  Pishkirlin on Wed Feb 08, 2012 5:53 am

Piratus wrote:P.S I am pretty sure Pishk incorporated parts of Machiavelli's book "The prince" in a mission somewhere. I feel I should dig it up, just for fun!
Actually, it was not in a mission but it was (and it is still) in the flag statement. It was my sarcastic response to all those Monarchs who used to approach us for job support right before their upcoming blockades, instead of "cultivating relationship over the time" In the statement I also hinted that our support could be granted for "something in exchange, which could namely be the command of a ship during the hostilities, the governorship of a lesser possession or merely a fair amount of shinies".
Needless to say, I haven't received any other request afterwards. Razz

As for Machiavelli's intent, I hardly believe it was matter of an attack to the Medici family, I rather believe it was a sincere call (to them) to take over the destiny of our country in a diffult historical circumstance. In fact, from then on, Italy is going to be dominated by foreign powers, so I guess he conceived 'The Prince' as a handbook of diplomacy and strategy for the leaders of those times... a sort of "Government for Dummies".

Somehow he followed Dante's thoughts on the matter:

"Ahi serva Italia, di dolore ostello, / nave sanza nocchiere in gran tempesta"
Oh, servant Italy, hostel of sorrow / ship without pilot in a great storm

They both were clearly seeing that the only pragmatic solution to the fragmentation of the country was finding a leader.

I hope this will help you in your research. I would be glad to help you furthermore, if needed.
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Re: Machiavelli.

Post  Piratus on Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:35 am

Thanks a ton for all your insight! Nothing is better than help from an Italian history geek when I need to do an assignment on Machiavelli. Wink

As for Machiavelli's intent, I hardly believe it was matter of an attack to the Medici family, I rather believe it was a sincere call (to them) to take over the destiny of our country in a diffult historical circumstance.
Sure, I can understand where you are going with this. Italy was a mess of city-states and counties fighting each other, just like the Holy Roman Empire, Germany of today. (I belive much of Italy was even a part of the HRE, but I am digressing Smile )
But from my sources all his literally works before and after "The Prince" were in support of republicanism (whatever you call it Smile ), the rule of many while "The Prince" is strongly supporting authoritarianism. How can we explain this without assuming it's a satire?
Secondly, I am pretty sure he wrote that book right after (or during?) beeing imprisoned and tortured by the Medici family. It would take a very special and alturistic kind of person to still support their rule after that, even if he belives it is for the good of Italy.
But my only source for that last argument is an article on cracked.com... so I will look into it someplace else before making any conclusions in my essay skeptical
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