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Game design and human behaiviour.

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Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Thu Dec 31, 2009 7:02 pm

I have been thinking a lot (perhaps to much), excuse me if I am writing poorly.

The one thing any game designer absolutley need to know are the three "elements" that makes a game, the formula that makes people want to play, and enjoy their experience.
The foundation of any game design:

1. Give the player some kind of ability and resources. Without a way to influence the game world, it's not a game, it's a movie. The classic example would be Marios ability to jump and his limited lives.

2. Give the player a challenge and punishment for failing the challenges. Without pits, platforms and goombas Mario would just be walking from the left to the right through all the levels.

3. Give the player a reward for making it through the challenges. Many times the reward is to unlock another part of the game, like a new level in Mario or that nice ship you always wanted. Other times the reward is more direct, like thoose neat fireworks on the end of each Mario level. Or that nice high score on the arcades.

Take away one and the game is pointless. What recently struck me is that this applies to more than just game design, but human behaiviour in general.

As humans, we start out with ways to influence the world with our on mind and body. We always seek some kind of reward, a good job, a family, maybe some luxury items. And in our way are a bunch of challenges likes studies or hard work.

Take away one and life becomes almost pointless.
A life where you can't influence your world and just watch things happen is no fun.
A life without challenges become boring in the long run, a lot of rich people could be used as an example. Ever seen a movie or similar where a rich guy basicly says he misses the old days when he had to work for money (Scrooge McDuck, anyone?).
A life with few rewards and to much punishment is simply a life not worth living.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Pishkirlin on Fri Jan 01, 2010 1:37 am

Piratus wrote:The one thing any game designer absolutley need to know are the three "elements" that makes a game, the formula that makes people want to play, and enjoy their experience.
The foundation of any game design:
1. Give the player some kind of ability and resources. [...]
2. Give the player a challenge and punishment for failing the challenges. [...]
3. Give the player a reward for making it through the challenges.[...]
Take away one and the game is pointless.
Not necessarily. Take Mario out of your mind and focus on other games. Dice, for instance. You have almost nothing of what you have described. The only thing you have is chance. Now take chess. In chess the chance element is zero. Still dice and chess have something in common: unpredictability of the system.

As for the similarity between games and life, yes, life is definitely the most beautiful game. Too bad we tend to play it in a very conventional manner. That's why we need other games. Fictional games. I believe their fictional character is what tells games apart from life.

So, I guess my definition of game is: an unpredictable fictional system organized in a set of rules and goals. It should apply to all games. Life included, if you remove 'fictional'. Unless life is fictional for something else, which could actually be.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Fri Jan 01, 2010 7:45 am

Pishkirlin wrote:
Piratus wrote:The one thing any game designer absolutley need to know are the three "elements" that makes a game, the formula that makes people want to play, and enjoy their experience.
The foundation of any game design:
1. Give the player some kind of ability and resources. [...]
2. Give the player a challenge and punishment for failing the challenges. [...]
3. Give the player a reward for making it through the challenges.[...]
Take away one and the game is pointless.
Not necessarily. Take Mario out of your mind and focus on other games. Dice, for instance. You have almost nothing of what you have described. The only thing you have is chance. Now take chess. In chess the chance element is zero. Still dice and chess have something in common: unpredictability of the system.
But a chess has all of that. The ability to move pieces, the challenge of fighting another player and the glory when you win. Dice is probably the same thing, except that the challenge is based on chance. You still have your ability to throw the dice, and if you win you will need to feel good about winning.
This is also why multiplayer games are so succesfull. There few better rewards beating other players,and challenge is always new and unpredictable.

As for the similarity between games and life, yes, life is definitely the most beautiful game. Too bad we tend to play it in a very conventional manner. That's why we need other games. Fictional games. I believe their fictional character is what tells games apart from life.
Yes, the only diffrence between games and reality is that games are fictional. And that's the point, no one wants to play a game where do every-day things. Even The Sims games have fiction and humor (what's the point of just eating and taking out the trash everyday?).
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:50 pm

More thinking from my side:
This is also what power is about.
If you are able to reward people for doing as you wish, or punish them for not doing it. You will have power over them. If you can give a man a fat paycheck for doing something, or threaten to shoot him if he don't, he will obey.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Zaidwanted on Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:19 am

if you think about it that way...
but life is not that simple, there are more things to think about.
what if the person you threatened does not obey, and then you shoot him.
the threathened also could try to avoid the bullets, and then beat the crap out of you XD
it sounds like a joke, but eh, what i gotta say? it's life! Shocked

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:50 am

Zaidwanted wrote:if you think about it that way...
but life is not that simple, there are more things to think about.
what if the person you threatened does not obey, and then you shoot him.
No man, no problem. Evil or Very Mad
the threathened also could try to avoid the bullets, and then beat the crap out of you XD
it sounds like a joke, but eh, what i gotta say? it's life! Shocked
Then he don't have enough force to force him. But I think you are right, things arn't that simple.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Zaidwanted on Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:57 am

THANK GOD

or life would be SO boring Razz

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Leonelle on Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:00 pm

I personally beleive that humans are all greedy pigs who only strive for happiness...

and why not? its makes ye happy?

W go thorw life day in and day out so we can earn the time to be happy. And we are always looking for more opportunities (easier ooportunities none the less) to be happy.

Take this extremely common situation.

Little kid goes to school because little kid beleives it will make him happy because it is fun (apparantly)

Little kid continues to go to school because of happiness.

Little kid soon realises the higher the grade the less fun it is (Who thought that up! im gonnna kill em! it puts everyone who goes to school through twelve years of torture not even including pre-school years and whatever ye plan on doing after school to continue yer education)

Little kid does not want to go to school

Little kid realises not going to school resultsin trouble which is the opposite of fun.

Little kid continues to go to shchool so he can continue not getting in trouble out of school which results in not happiness which means more happiness out of school.

Why does kid do homework?- because he (regretably like me) might just love his advanced algebra homework) or because he does not want to get into trouble.

When kid does not do homework, it is because he traded that time for happiness and believed that the happiness he got from of not doing his homework in the first place outweighs the unhappiness of getting in trouble.


Ye get the point, every thing that kid does is for more happiness.

Now for another even more common situation-

Adult goes to work (after schooling of course) and gets a boring job which results in lots of money

Adult continues to go to work for that big wad of cash

Adult uses this money to buy things to survive (and a few things on the side)

Adult uses these thigns to survive.

Adult likes to survive (because theyre not suicidal) which makes them mildy happier that they can suport themselves.

Adult continues to buy more things on the side which make them happy.



And even charity givers are greedy little pigs.

Why do they give to charity? because it makes them feel HAPPY that they are helping others!


its just the same as buying a whole heap of chocolate bars..



So our point in life is to find the best way for us to get maximum happiness through minimum unhappiness.

because unhappiness leades to happiness...


does this sound like Karma?

what comes around goes around?


Conclusion- We are all greedy pigs.

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Leonelle on Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:05 pm

Oh yes! forgot to explain people wanting power

Person does whatever they do to gain status

Person is no known by more people who look up to them

Person gains power over these people (People continue to suck up because they want that power aswell)

Person now has more ways of getting what they want

Getting what they want makes person happy because they feel powerful AND because thos wants also make them happy


Though that person also has to rotect that power and must do a lot of things in order to protect it.

Which includeskeeping their status..


which is a mighty hard thing on its own what with society changing every second and people coming to realisation with ther society-driven fishbowl every few seconds

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Wed Jan 06, 2010 1:20 pm

Precisley, people do things to get rewarded for doing it (or avoid punishment for not doing it). Very few people do selfless things with no thoughts of reward, that's why we are stuck with a lot of problems. The schoolboy knows he will get in trouble if he don't go to school, and he may also realise that he need to go to school to get a good future job. People could try and convince the boy that it's good to know things, that it might help society, but if there is no real reward or no real punishment he will stay at home instead and spend his time on other things that are more rewarding.

I think that is because humans aren't made to live in large societies like today. We are made to live with a small band of say, 2 or 3 families walking around the countryside hunting and collecting nuts and fruit together. Everything that was not a part of that small band was either enemies or food. Therefore many tend to treat "outsiders" like enemies and exploit them if they can. Here we have the origins of a great deal of humanity's problems.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Leonelle on Wed Jan 06, 2010 10:13 pm

lol.. i remember a really long and tireing game.. something called impossible pinball..

awesome game..


and at the end of the 120 lvls..

it said.. YAY! you finished! here, have a cookie..


i felt mucha rewarded

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Zaidwanted on Thu Jan 07, 2010 2:13 am

rly?
it's already a remward for me to finish the game! XD

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:03 am

leonelle wrote:lol.. i remember a really long and tireing game.. something called impossible pinball..

awesome game..


and at the end of the 120 lvls..

it said.. YAY! you finished! here, have a cookie..


i felt mucha rewarded
That sound awesome! xD I guess some the reward is to simply unlock new levels.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Sparkywolf on Thu Jan 07, 2010 9:17 am

A lot of games depend on the reward of unlocking.. Look at all the collecting you have to do in the "lighter" games such as Harvest Moon. There aren't even levels there, just finding things. Or, unlocking new abilities or minigames in Plants vs Zombies. Actually, I can't think of a game where you don't unlock some reward or get a congrats you win at the end. Or both.

I would say unlocking rewards are very much relied on in modern gaming.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:11 pm

I think you are right. Unlocking is very important in games, by unlocking stuff you can make all 2 elements of a game at the same time.
Unlocking a new unit, or a new weapon, will give the player new resources and he will feel rewarded by doing so.
Unlocking a new level will give the player some new challanges, and he will feel rewarded by doing so.

I would say if you don't unlock new things, a game will be a grindfest. Doing the same exact things over and over and never getting anything in return... even putting the best fireworks in the world at the end of the level won't help. lol
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Leonelle on Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:55 pm

Wanna cookie?

http://www.mofunzone.com/online_games/gravity_pinball_challenge.shtml#

Is where you can find a game that only rewards you with a non existant cookie.

Yet once I complete it my life feels fulfilled.

I just cant get enough of that game.

Right here is my proof that self acheivement (ad virtual cookies) are Awesome rewards.

...yea, you think its easy now? wait till it starts shaking...

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Zaidwanted on Sat Jan 09, 2010 5:52 am

do you want an addictve game? try this one!

http://www.mofunzone.com/online_games/azul_baronis.shtml

it already is a reward if you make it to round 5!
i once made it to lvl 12, my max kills before i died was 11

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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

Post  Piratus on Tue Jan 12, 2010 11:36 am

"You can discover more about a person in an hour of play, than in a lifetime of conversation."
a bit offtopic, but I like that qoute from Plato.
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Re: Game design and human behaiviour.

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